I think my husband and I might need to consider a temporary separation. Not a "break," but a time where we keep in close contact while seeing counselors separately.
I would like to ask our counselor about this, but I think it will take her months to get around to our current issues. She's so stuck on analyzing our childhoods that she is refusing (yes, refusing) to help us with our present issues.
The friend who advised me that a separation might be beneficial was in a relationship that is scarily like mine, only she stayed for eight years until she realized that he wasn't going to change without some serious incentive, like her leaving. Unfortunately, her relationship ended, and so did my parents' relationship when they tried this. My friend says separation is like a tourniquet; it may be necessary to keep someone from bleeding to death, but used incorrectly it can do irreparable harm.
This August Chad will be stationed somewhere else (we're not sure where yet), and we have discussed me going back to the University of Wyoming for a semester to finish up classes that I can't do online. He is in favor of that, but in order for some of our issues to be solved (hopefully) he will need to be aware that if I go back to UW, it's not just for school---it's because I believe that without drastic action, our relationship is not going to survive.

Opinions? Experiences? Does separation always sound the death knell for a marriage?

Kerense and I have had 'issues' - mostly my rage - that requires one of us leave. Since she's more stable than me, it's usually me that leaves. Fortunately, with lots of prayer and psychiatric treatment, the rage issues are now few and far between.

When I leave, it's not a trial separation to see if divorce is the answer. It is, rather, a chance for both of us to cool down before we try to handle the hot topic.

These separations are never longer than a week, but usually the hot topics are not as deep-rooted as what I've seen you discussing. It may take longer.

If you decide to try a long-term separation, you must consider some things:

• What are the requirements for your return
• What changes are *you* willing to make in order to meet his changes
• Are you willing to accept the chance that he may not want to re-unite

These questions must be answered before you even talk to him. Consider them long and hard. Do not discuss the third question with him. That will throw a monkey-wrench into the works. Just be aware that it may happen that way.

Mandy,
I wish you and Chad the best. I've been praying for your situation, and I hope that God will intervene before it gets to that.

Are there children involved?

If your counselor is stuck in your childhoods :screwy: and not listening to your needs then get a new counselor.

I think that I'm in favour of the separation. Absense makes the heart grow fonder. With you guys away from each other, you'll either realize whether or not you miss each other and whether you both will make the necessary changes needed to make the relationship work... or you'll realize that maybe this wasn't meant to be.

No children, thank God.
I wish we could get a new counselor, but she is the only civilian one we can find who has the necessary English skills. Once they move us out of Korea we'll have more options.

Thanks all, you've given me a lot to think about. Will go ponder for awhile...

I agree with the new counselor thing...it's too bad your choices are so limited...from what you've stated, I think a temporary situation might be a good idea...I would be sure Chad knows, tho (like you said) that it goes deeper than just you going to school, you know? He's gotta be aware of what's going on & how serious it is...

Military psychologists and chaplains aren't bad. Have you thought of going to one of them? As a spouse, you're welcome to go.

Well Luckily you're in a situation where you can separate and get your heads clear without too much fuss. Military can be a boon in that fashion.

This past week has been helpful for Misty and I... We're patched up now, but since we move shortly, she's already enrolled the kids out there, and is staying with the kids during the week, visiting me a few days during the week, and will bring the kids home on the weekends so we can be a family... and I try to make it out there to spend time with them.

Dude - that's gotta be rough. How long before you move?

Hmm, guess I'm the only one opposed to separation.

I never understood what could be accomplished apart, that couldn't be accomplished while under the same roof. As a matter of fact, I always thought it would be harder to accomplish ANYTHING when you're not even together to talk on a day-to-day basis.

We just celebrated our 10th anniversary in August. I adore my husband. But lemme tell you, there were times were I was actually trying to figure out how to kill him without getting caught.

Some of you guys know all the crap we went through with my DHs alcoholism and drug use. It's too long to explain here, but let me just say that when I sat down and prayed about it, I just didn't think God wanted me to go.

My husband's issue is an illness. I was never in danger, nor were my kids. He never abused me or cheated on me. And God always made sure we had what we needed. Maybe that's the difference. In my eyes, leaving my husband would have been like leaving a cancer patient, just because he/she had cancer.

Mandy, are you in danger? Is he hurting you? Are you afraid?

What do you hope to accompish in a physical separation?

I'm w/ Lynne on this one. If there is no imminent danger or an affair I don't see the 'need' to seperate...I can definitely see the 'desire' if you are snapping at each other all the time, but sometimes our desires are just that..... OUR desires.

How long have you been married and are you open to sharing some of your probs? I'm sure there are some here who have conquered or BTDT what yawl are going thru.

Praying!

Yes, but then I've thrown us at their mercy---since it's a past domestic violence issue, it's up to them to agree with me that it's a past issue. If they don't agree, life gets tricky :( They have all these consequences set up if someone reports domestic violence, even if they both just desperately want help, that I'm surprised it ever gets reported except if someone ends up in the hospital.

you're just in a tight spot as far as that counseling thing....praying for you sister!

As he reminded me (like I could have forgotten), yesterday it was officially a year since the last incident and it's time for me to be "over" this. And we're going to ignore the fact that he was in training for seven months of that, and then he had to live in barracks for three months before he could move in with me, so we've only lived in the same house for two months in the past year, and of course he's going to be extra careful when I have my own apartment and can not allow him to visit if I want.
I'm not worried about things getting as bad as they were before, not any time soon, but the root behaviors are still there. If we dropped this topic now (like I did so many times before) in a few months or a year we'll be right back where we started from. His way of thinking needs to change, and for that I believe he needs a counselor focusing on him rather than us. And I probably need the same thing; after all, an emotionally healthy person would have recognized the situation and gotten out of there quick (I think they would have anyway).
Also I was having problems talking with the counselor in front of him. I am so used to censoring what I say...
So I guess there are two problems that a separation might help:
1. Any issues that are brought up (either his personally or both of ours) will not result in another violent incident.
2. We are causing a lot of hurt to each other in day to day life that we don't know how to avoid. Many behaviors and situations that are habit to him seem threatening to me. A separation would put a stop to that, allowing us to work on our issues and learn to live together again.

Our second anniversary was November 29th.

Right now it's just words, and I can handle words B) But I do not want things to go back the way they were before---if they do I am leaving and I am not coming back, so that's why I am considering a separation. It's drastic, but it's got a chance of working, and I'm not certain there is a chance otherwise.

ok, I understand better. For some reason I didn't get the domestic violence. I can see how a separation might be necessary to get his attention. I'm not saying it's ok to play games. My thinking is that in this kind of situation you're removing yourself and hopefully giving him time to think. HOWEVER, if he does not seek counseling nothing will ever change.

I don't have a lot of experience in this area and I feel like I don't know how to answer you Mandy. Do abusers get better? Does he think he has a problem?

Tricky question. He says that he absolutely believes his behavior before was wrong, but that it will not get out of control again. He doesn't believe that he still has a problem, even though he can't give me a straight answer about why he was acting that way before. He has told me that he is only going to marriage counseling to make me feel better, and that the only problems we have right now are mine.
I've heard of abusive people getting better before, but mostly those stories end with "And then one day he snapped..."
I believe God can heal anyone, but they have to want to be healed, they have to want to fight and struggle for their self-control and mental health. But if they are in relationships while they are in recovery, I think maybe that makes it harder to change the abusive patterns of behavior.
Then of course there's the subject of children---we don't have any right now, but unless one of us gets sterilized, that is a possibility, and we both want children. If it was so easy for him to justify his behavior toward me, I wonder how easy it will be for him to smack a child.
Oh yeah, story: I told Chad about when I was babysitting my cousin's son (Jordon) this summer. Jordon was going through a really bratty mean phase. I picked him up because he was playing with the fair exhibits, and Jordon managed to 1. grab my hair and pull HARD 2. hit me in the face and 3. bite my cheek, simoultaneously. When I told Chad this (laughing a bit, it must have looked pretty funny), he said he didn't care how old the child was, if he had been there Jordon would have ended up on his butt wondering why his face hurt. The baby was ten months old at the time.
So it's stuff like that I worry about too. Though I am being careful to guard against pregnancy, if I did get pregnant in the near future I would feel obligated to leave.
Think I'm rambling now. I'm going to go finish eating the hot chocolate mix...

So for clarification, what exactly is the problem? Is it that you faer he will hurt you again? Or something else....

Who knows? And that's part of the problem. This is the longest time we've gone without a violent incident since we got married, and that makes me hopeful. But I confronted him many times and seen him repent in tears, only to go back to acting like that a couple weeks later. I think this time is different because I'm not allowing it to be swept under the rug, but I don't know if that's enough.
Even if nothing happens again, we have a lot to heal from. We have screwy patterns of behavior so ingrained in our relationship that we don't know how to act like normal human beings. That's why I think individual counseling is necessary, and for that I think we need to be apart because I've seen in my family how counseling can trigger violent behavior. So if we're apart, it might be just fine, but if we're together while in counseling, life could get very bad.

Hi Mandy,

I am praying for you.

what I have quoted above is a huge RED FLAG. This is called denial and is very dangerous. This to me indicates he has not taken responsibility for the violence. MOST abusers will say sorry and that they won't do it again but without help they inevitably will. If he is talking like your continued fears are your problem then he has not understood or taken responsibility for his actions.

Threats of violence to a baby is another RED FLAG.

I am not trying to scare you or tell you what to do but the biggest problem with domestic violence is the silence. I know you feel in an awkward situation with the military counsellors but hiding the violence will only perpetuate it in the long wrong. Given what you have said I believe you are right to be concerned about the future. I was going to caution against separation until I read about the violence and his apparent attitude to it. AN attitude of 'it's in the past, leave it there' is dangerous. Based on what you have said I believe your fears are grounded.

You are a precious child of God, should not live in fear and should not be restricted in any way by the fear of violence.

I pray that God will lead you clearly and that you will hear his voice. Only you can hear what he has to say to you.

Bless you both

Hope

Hi Mandy! !

You got one tough situation that is for sure.

I think a seperation would be a good thing. If he is not acknowledging that he has a problem then he will never overcome it. I'm not a counsellor or anything, but I imagine that it's got to be like a alcholic, and that he will always have those impulses, and he can supress them for a while, but without admitting his life long problem, he will never overcome it.

The same would be if you offered an Alcoholic $100 to not drink for a week. Sure he would stop drinking for a week, but it wouldn't help at all.
I'm going to say that the Seperation you are proposing MAY not be a good one though. It confuses me and it may confuse him as well. The seperation that you need to make is a seperation with the statement:
"You still have a problem, You need to seek counselling, I will not live with you until you seek help and change in this area"
But I think the seperation that you are proposing sounds more like this:
"Logistically, It would be great if I could go back to school in the states, while you finished this up... and oh yeah... you have a problem still."

Even if you take him aside and tell him the real reasons you are seperating, he will mentally block it out and believe the reason is for school.

That is just my thoughts. You do have a seriously tough situation though, I will pray for you. Please go through the bible and Read all the Verses on Marriage. Don't just look for advice from consellors and christian advice, look to the word of god.

Mandy,
I agree with what Hope and Patrick said. I especially agree about the terms of your separation. You need to be clear. I know you're afraid to speak up now, but maybe you can wait until you're back in the states. Let him know you've been thinking and then tell him how you REALLY feel.

Remember, you are loved. And God wants you to be safe.

Yeah, Mandy....you've been in my prayers alot lately....study the word, let God guide you...

You are in my prayers.
You have a good group of people here for you.
We are here to lift you up.

Thank you, everybody :hug: I will reply later when I have time, but I just wanted to let you all know that I really appreciate the advise and encouragement.