I just read seige's thread on CF and his comment that are only 2-4 times a week down from 5-7 times really struck me in a wierd way.... To me, in this relationship, 2-4 times a week would totaly blow my mind. I mean, wow!!! Since I have been married I've never done it that much...

Since my marriage(since prior to day 1) is not exactly that healthy, it rarely(like maybe once a month-twice if he's really daring) happens (and usually on his terms in the way he prefers or close to it)......A good thing for pregnancy avoidance, but bad for making me feel ugly and rejected..but anyway...

How has the comfort and frequency of your "encounters" been affected by the health of your relationship?

Are we talking about sex?

:tease:

We do up to 4-6 times a week. Depends on our moods/stress/his work...

When we were first married and pre-kids, we did it ALOT more. :eyebrows:

I honestly couldn't imagine that often.......well, with my ex it was like that but my husband....well, things are different.... :(

.
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I just saved a TON at Geico.

Please take into account that we are relatively young, pre-kids and are really focusing on our marriage since my wife's affair so we really pay attention to things and frequency of sex is a real indicator (not a cause) of marital problems.

Just lost everything I typed.. Stupid me forgot to hit "add reply"

Would you consider me "relatively old" at 29??????????

I've read a million things from marrieds who have kids and are my age and older and are quite "active".....I feel embarrassed that my husband is so platonic toward me and that my "sex life" is practically dead....


I gotta go.. He's pressuring me to go because dinner is about done...

I would say we used to be 5-7 times a week even post having Katheryn but this was when Louis was not away working. I'd say that we now average 3 times a week when he's home. I think intimacy builds intimacy. There was a time when if we forewent the coming together it would show in our day to day lives because it was important to have that connection.

I'm sorry String- I never meant to indicate that you were "old." I mostly said that for Squat- you know things don't work as well when you get to be his age...

I do think the kids thing will affect our current amount of affection (though I hope not!)- I'm certain that is part of why you have sex so infrequently.

Now there is no prescribed amount of times that equals a healthy marriage. For some people once a year is good... these are crazy people! (j/k) If you guys aren't having sex, have you addressed this with your husband? I know if my wife came to me and said, "Honey, I'd like to talk to you about having sex more often." I'd have the kids at the neighbors house and be nude in the living room in sex.. err... seconds. I'm certain he's not happy. I would suggest trying to figure out why you aren't having sex. Is it b/c he's too tired? Is it b/c not enough "nonsexual touch" is happening? Is it something medical? Does he have a testosterone imbalance? Does your husband know that you regret being married to him and having the kids? That would be a really be a wall for me, "If my wife doesn't like even being around me why would she want to have sex with me?"

As always, you and yours are in our prayers.

:chicken:

:happy:

I agree with Sarah...."intimacy builds intimacy". On average, I'd say it's about 4x/week for us. But when there are days upon days that go by (for whatever reason) that we don't have sex, it's easy to get into the habit of NOT having sex.

And when we don't I notice other parts of our relationship suffer. We have shorter tempers, get more annoyed, and just don't seem as close emotionally.

When things are "on track", all parts of the marriage relationship seem to work better.

The 5 love languages... :thumbsup:

It's helped us out ;)

Is "Geico" pronounced GAY-co?

And what would YOU know about it?

Oh yeah....nevermind....:whistle:

I hate to put a damper on the sex/intimacy/marital health thing but my ex and I were having sex about 3 times a week right up to the time he left. And that was after 20 years of marriage. There were times in our marriage when it was much less (bad times) but it was pretty healthy towards the end and right up until the week before he left. OUCH

I guess it just shows that each marriage is different, but communication is really important. If you are both happy with the frequency then that should be fine but it doesn't sound like you are happy. In fact, it sounds like it might not be satisfactory for either of you. That is when you really need to talk about it.

I'm not so sure about that.... :unsure: Look at all the couples here on this board who ahve kids and sex...

Yes. It wasn't until after he had talked to our priest in a counselling session a few times that it came to light that he has emotional issues that make it hard for him to approace me in that way. That is why before, whenever it happened, certain things had to happen to help him stay in his fantasy so he didn't have to face the reality of me or my emotions..Those things made the experience horrible for me and he knew it but didn't want to deal with the knowledge that he was hurting me emotionally. Keeps himself distanced.. Even so, he has expressed that he feels like a wolf preying on innocent sheep or like an oversexed slimeball by even trying to get me "in the mood" so he'd rather sit back and watch me and wait for cues. Which with my history of sexual abuse isn't gonna happen often :( The few times I have been more aggressive and tried to "start something" he pushed me away and looked at me like I was crazy. Totally humiliating. Why should I want to put myself into that position again for what would probably be another rejection and humiation for me. Nope. Can't do it. Was hard enough for me to try those times and to have them end like they did......No....no...can't do it...

He's not. He has verbally expressed that he'd like to do it like al the time which came as a total shock to me since he seems so unsexual the majority of the time. i think he's gradually trying to be more expressive....

Saying "I'm too tired" "I'm exhausted" "you keep me up late all the time and I never get enough sleep" Is his motto...7 hours instead of 8 apparently exhausts him...although I swear that I am not the one keeping him from going to sleep at 8PM.. :rollseyes:

We aren't as touchy feely as other couples...Lack of emotional connection probably contributes to that...

Nope

Going through what we did last fall, how could he not?

I think part of my thing is that this is the rest of my life. I have no other "legal" outlet. He's all I've got. There are no other options. And when I feel rejected like I have for the last 7 years....That's a lot of frustration and hurt to have to live with....

Thank you...

Fix your quotes, String...I could barely make any sense out of that! :blink:

What did I do wrong? I tried redoing them, but they are coing up the same....

No caps.........I fixed it....... B) :thanks:

And DEBBY saves the day! :bow:

:nod:

no caps?? What does that mean? I just used the quote button.....??

"unsexual"...that is a funny word. I'm not laughing at your husband or your situation, but that word just seemed funny to me when I read it.

First off I want to commend you String on your commitment to stick this thing out for the rest of your life! In today's age where all that is important seems to be an individual's happiness you are choosing a higher road- thank you for showing me there is some good out there. Just last week a friend of mine filed for divorce because he "isn't happy" with his wife and his pastor gave him the okay because, "divorces happen in Christian marriages and Jesus just said that God hates divorce, He didn't outright say you can't do it." :wall: :nono:

It sounds like your marriage is at a stalemate right now and I totally understand both sides of the situation- I've felt like the pervert chasing my wife desiring sex and I've felt rejected by my advances which makes me feel... well undesired. I hear where you are coming from but I'm surprised that his drive doesn't help push him into trying again. Are you welcoming when he makes his advances?

I'm in a desert. Once a month(maybe even twice!) he'll give me a teaspoon of water. Do you think I will refuse it? Granted the water always must be drank rather quickly...

Its like he waits and waits until he's about to pop ( of course I know there is more action with him going on without me when he's in the shower) so when it happens there isn't really much to it, and of course it often has to carry a bit of flavor from his pornographically inspired preferences... :bored:

There aren't the emotional connection, foreplay, or any of the good things that could go along with sex, but where I am, I gotta take what I can get you know?

To me it seems so very bleak. Seems like a sad thing, like I've made my bed and now I have to lie in it... :( I don't feel like I've taken a higher road, I often feel like my hands and feet have been tied and my mouth gagged..If it weren't for the existance of the children...... :bored: I feel so bad thinking and feeling that way.. But really I should just take my own advice and put in out of my mind and think on higher things and pray...

Now there is some debate on this in Christian circles but I tend to think (this is the Bible according to CJ) that him "taking care of business" on his own is what has kept this from being a problem that was fixed years ago. Instead of dealing with the sexual issues in your marriage he has decided to forgo it and view pornography and just take care of it himself. This breeds an unhealthy view of sex (as an individual satisfaction thing- read "selfish") and is ruining what God intended sex to be like.

I wish you guys could go to some good counselor who would give you all this great advice and he'd listen and you'd listen and you'd begin to see that change can happen. Right now it just seems like you are treading water (both of you) and every day that you do that you're both missing out on the marriage God WANTS you to have.

I wish he'd chime in on here like he used to...

Keep your head up and know that if you are faithful and even if just you are willing to try God will back you and bless your marriage! I know that anything is possible! Keep the faith.... ya old lady!







J/K- I'm 29 too! Isn't 30 looming on you. I feel like once that happens I'm going to need knee surgery or start complaining of old wrestling injuries, or telling stories that go nowhere. My hairs going to all turn gray or fall out and I'll start popping out with liverspots!

I broke him of the porn habit years ago, but occasionally it rears its ugly head. I think that through years of viewing it(prior to me) he tastes and preferences grew and developed. The effects of his interactions with it way back then are still resounding today...

He knows this and we have discussed it. I am afraid that for me, sex the way God intended it to be is just a fantasy...I am afraid it is too late to ever be good and healthy..He has often tried to convince me that we can be like some of the Christian Saint couples who chose to end all sexual relations completely and live as monastics... :( He says that this could be an option when we are older, but I happen to know that he once corresponded with a priest online asking about this kind of life in the "now"...There are so many emotional and psycholoIgical issues that affect this area of our lives from both our sides...I really think that he should have gone the monastic route rather than the one he chose because he really wants that type of life. He'd be happier that way..

Right now, we have talked to our priest a handful of times. He really soesn't want to go to counselling. We are considering changing churches and the priest there is much more centered on living the faith and Christian life. Our current priest is so busy..he is building his own house and keeping up with all his duties as priest and helping out people and such, that he has gotten himself spread a little too thin, I think. I have asked if he would consider counselling with the new guy, and his answers were kind of vague-he love to be vague and in direct-but I think that maybe he might...We'll just have to wait and see.... :waiting:

I'll tell him I started a thread about this and see if he's interested...

I do not want to be 30. That sounds so old!!! related to this thread, my age makes me feel really old. I feel that my prime healthy years are being wasted away from forced abstinance and i'm shrivelling up...Kind of a "use it or lose it" type thing... Is that odd??

Ok, I've gotta get out my :lena: here............30 IS NOT OLD!!!!!!!! 40 IS!!!! :P

I'll be 32 in a few months, so watch it! :smack: :P



String....I don't understand....he can wank himself in the shower, but chooses not to have sex with you? Sex between the 2 of you is a GIFT! Wankin' in the shower is SELFISH!.....ugh...I don't even know what to say....:screwy: I feel sorry for you. Seriously. I honestly wish you'd both get PROFESSIONAL counselling.

:agree:

And 30 is NOT old. :box: ...32 is :P

RIGHT THAT'S IT!!! :box: :box:



40 IS NOT OLD!! :lena: :hammer:

There is no grey here, hair falling out or knee replacements and all the vital bits still work.........grrrr :nono:
(well I think they do - it's been a while :hide: :haha: )

Now for the serious stuff. String what he's telling you is bollocks!! And from what I see in scripture the whole thing is just plain sinful.

As a married couple. it is way out of order for him to suggest a monastic life. The monastic life is for the dedicated single for the Lord, NOT for a married couple.

Besides that, it seems to be a lie and a simple excuse for not relating in a godly manner as husband and wife. As Honey so eloquently put it, 'wanking in the shower' instead meeting the needs of your spouse is far from a monastic godly life. It is selfish, sinful and not meeting the obligations of a husband to his wife. If he is doing this because he doesn't think he can get what he needs from you, then this needs to be addressed as well.
As for wanting you to perform to pornographic fantasies, this is a sexual dysfunction borne out of the consequences of the pornoprahic industry and also needs to be addressed. It is totally inappropriate for you to feel bound to these images. They are images you can never live up to and are dishonouring to the daughter of the King. My heart goes out ot you that you are being subjected to this.
It may seem this is the only way to have any sexual activity but please don't do anything that reduces you to an object of fantasy. It is damaging to you, I can hear it, and you are worth more than that. It is not worth it. I am not condemning him, we all have those things in our lives we are yet to overcome, but he needs to get help.
It is quite common for those who have been, or are, addicted to pornography, to find it difficult to participate in what would be considered normal sexual activity. It can be worked through but will likely take time and professional help. I actually think the whole pornography thing is something none of us should ever take lightly. It is seriously evil and destructive to marriages, family and relationships. We need to be disturbed about pornography, not drooling over it (I know, some of you drooled on this site over such things but sometimes I just have to say what I feel about it. I am saddened when I see christian men joking about pornography. Joking about sex etc is different from joking about pornography. It is nothing but EVIL and I believe needs to be treated as such).

I really believe these are serious issues on both your parts and causing each of you to live a life far short of the full life intended by God, to reflect him.

I also agree that professional counselling is probably necessary for BOTH of you, if you want to live the life God intended for you and your family.

Please don't live in this misery any longer. Get help. You are worthy of a better life than you are experiencing and it is possible. Dare I say it, with or without your husband. If he won't get counselling, then get it yourself.

Praying for you String :pray: As I have said before, I am very concerned for you and I pray for wisdom, strength and breakthrough for you.

Bless you, my friend :pray:

For the most part he doesn't want this at this time, but I think at one point he did...There are many examples of this lifestyle being chosen by Christian couples over the last 2000 years so it is not entirely unheard of. He would like for this to be an end of life decision, you know, like when we are old...

He knows, he is aware. We have talked about it. He says there are major emotional blocks that are preventing him from turning to me..These must be addressed..But he doesn't like to go to counselling. Professional counselling is out of the question because it is so expensive and we only have one income that is barely getting us by...We can't afford it..

That's not quite what I said. His preferences and likes have been influeced by the porn industry. This obviously spills over into the bedroom. He soesn't expect me to "act it out". Things have gotten better since we have had a little counselling..He's not all that deviant and disgusting..

I know we need some kind of help. Even if we had that kind of extra money laying around, he would refuse to go to a secular counsellor, or one that doesn't share our beliefs, becaue their religious beliefs would be in conflict with ours and that would definately cause problems in perception and solution suggestions...My only hope is that we can find a priest who will be willing to help, as ours is. But I feel like I am imposing on him and his time..He is so busy these days and has never suggested more increased visits or sessions, so we've only been a few times... I don't know what to do...


I really feel embarrassed about this thread turning this way...I never meant for it to go in this direction and I probably shouldn't have revealed so much that is personal about our relationship. seige wanted my husband to chime in, but I don't know if I want him to know that I've said so much here. I am embarassed and I feel bad about it and he would probably be angry that I said so much...

I feel ashamed that this area of our lives is so messed up and unhealthy and embarrassed when I see all the healthy couples on here with their inunendoes and :eyebrows: because I don't have what is so normal for everyone else. Its humiliating...I should probably request this thread to be closed and deleted or something...I don't know...

Hey, I'm not exactly in a healthy relationship here String, so please don't feel any condemnation from me. If I implied that then I am genuinely sorry and wholeheartedly apologise.

I probably wasn't specific enough when I talked about the pornographic fantasy stuff. I actually wasn't thinking deviant and I don't want to suggest that about your husband. I just know the effects of pornography and how it influences even so called 'normal' practices.

I'm no angel and have had my own issues with pornography addiction in the past. Yes, a woman with a pornography issue. The reasons are often different than for many men but it was there and I also know my hubby had the same issues that affected our sexual relationship as well. It gives a flavour to the whole thing that is very harmful and dishonouring to both the husband and the wife. So regularity is not everything.

Please know that I am not trying to point the finger. How can I? I have three pointing back at myself. But I do know this stuff is serious and really needs to be hit head on. I think this sort of stuff is an issue that is not talked about enough in the church because of the shame. None of us want to talk about it for many reasons, not the least being the fear of the condemnation of the body. And yet in Christ there need be no shame, only truth, forgiveness, redemption and freedom.

I also know that it can be overcome and we can be completely free and cleansed by the power of the blood of Jesus. That is true in my own life. Having said that, sometimes I am afraid that if I marry again, how would I handle it if any of the issues surfaced again. That is something I will just have to continue to trust God with.

If anything I said caused you any harm again I sincerely apologise. I can get a little grrr about the whole deal but really it is about the whole industry, it's effect and how it is entrapping so many of God's people. It is not meant to be personal angst or condemnation of you or your hubby. I guess where I get a little hot under the collar is where I feel that a man, or a woman as in my case, is not prepared to do everything and anything they can to deal with it, but I have to realise that each one of us is doing the best we can. I should have been more careful with my words.

If you are uncomfortable with where this has gone and that too much has been said then have it deleted, however please do not feel embarassed, ashamed or humiliated. You (and your hubby) are not alone in this. It is a very common problem, even in many 'normal and healthy' looking marriages (I'm not suggesting anything about any marriage on this board so no one need worry about defending their marriage. I just know how widespread it is even, and maybe especially, in the church). It's just that not many people are prepared to talk about it and how much it affects them, so it is hidden away, growing like an insidious cancer. I think the body of Christ has to face this threat head on and we need to all support each other.

:pray: :hug:

No, Hope, You haven't offended me or said anything to put me off.. I am just sick of this whole thing..Yes I am embarrassed (that is the best word I can think of right now) about it being so screwed up and not having the ability to enjoy what most of the people on this board enjoy in ther marraiges... I don't think I can blame it all on Pron either. Ther are emotional issues for both of us and for him that's as far as it goes.. "issues" What he's gonna do about it...? He syas just pray and grow closer to GOd and these things will work themselves out and I believe that yes that will certainly help tons, but action must be taken. Healing must be sought and we can't just sit back here waiting...

*sigh* I am thinking about talking to Fr. and asking him what he thinks we should do. I mena meeting with him eer couple of months really isn't helping much...A little definately, there have been slight changes, but so much remains unchanged..

I do acknowledge that a big part of it is me. I bicker at him and am irritated with the things he does. I need to get over it and accept that that is who he is and I cannot change him. If there will be any growth in him it will be accomplished by God and not my nagging....But at our current church there isn't much opportunity..There is little accountability and the spirituality is weaker than at the one we are considering going to. He himself admitted that as long as we stay here, he can half-ass it as far as active spiritual growth ut at the other, it is a smaller sommunity and there is more expected of you..You are more forced to "step up to the plate". This would help us in our marriage I think....

Now that I really understand :hug:

I agree! I will pray that you get some assistance. Some truly accountable help for you both.

Yes, I do understand that there is change required for both of you. There always is (except, of course, in my case it was ALL his fault :whistle:)


You are trying to find a way and I believe God will make a way for you. I don't know what it will look like, but there will be a way.

:pray: :hug:

Thank you so much...
:hug:

I've heard the "if we both grow closer to God then we'll grow closer together" argument before. In our premarital counselling they described it as if we are standing on two opposite sides of the earth and throw a grappling hook at God (at a central point) and then start climbing our ropes the distance between us will get smaller and smaller until we are right next to each other with God. It's a really nice thought but I think that the "climbing the rope" part often is dealing with the issues in our marriage. Things like becoming a more Godly husband, loving my wife in the way she needs to be loved, etc. So this growing toward God separately is kind of a joke- does that make sense? It's just renaming "working on your marriage" as "growing toward God." I don't know if this makes any sense.

String I hope that you realize that you have no reason to be embarassed (I'm not discounting your feelings). Even those on here who toot their own horns about being in these perfect marriages have struggles from time to time... in fact I bet they happen more than they let on. As a wise person I know once said (my wife), "If you aren't working on something in your marriage then there is something you aren't working on." Essentially it means that EVERYONE'S marriage can grow and needs to be actively working on something.

I don't think negatively of your husband, nor do I think anyone else here does. We voted and pretty much all think it's all your fault (TOTALLY A JOKE!!!!!! TRYING TO BREAK THE TENSION!!)

We care and at least I know that God is going to bless your faithfulness one day with the marriage He desires you to have- and with the man you are married to now. Just so you know when it happens you'd better contact me and I'll give you a "I told you so".

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hehe....





Yes, basil's a good bro.

Ummm, WHO did you say was joking again???




KIDDING!!!! :whistle:

String, I was always under the impression that you didn't want your husband touching you in a sexual manner?

In any event, I suppose I can join you in your situation. It's hard for me to put what I'm feeling/experiencing into words. Much like you, I'm shocked and astounded by the frequency that everyone else here is reporting and it truly makes me feel like God is playing a big joke on me.

no..He's the one who's "stand-offish"...Come to realise that he has emotinal issues that make it hard for him to approace me and I have issues that make it hard for me to act on sexual feelings....Big mess..

Yeah, the people round here are just freaks! :P

I was thinking and praying for you guys (String) this morning and something just really hit me square between the eyes. I think we're struggling with the same issue and it is just presenting in different ways.

When I woke up this morning as soon as I opened my eyes and looked over at my sleeping wife (I ALWAYS wake up first) a simple phrase popped into my head, "All I desire is to have the marriage that I can never have." This phrase has popped into my head probably 2-3 times a day ever since our "issue".

For some reason this morning I thought, "What the f---?! I'm laying here looking at my naked ( :eyebrows: ) sleeping wife snuggled next to me and though she hasn't done ANYTHING other than snore quietly (it's really quite cute- though she says she doesn't snore) I was already thinking negative thoughts about her, our marriage and our future. I often have little phrases pop into my head like this- "I just want my wife to love me like I love her" or "All I want is for her to be faithful" or "If only I could be sure of her faithfulness". These comments are all negative but I think the worst part is that they imply that things won't get better and that I'm never going to feel any better and we're never going to get better. Our car has a flat and I decide to go get firewood and just accept that we're going to be stuck here forever instead of changing the tire.

It seems like both you and your husband feel the same way (I hate to say especially him but it does appear that way). You guys are in a rough patch and if I even suggest that you guys could have this awesome marriage that God wants you to have you snicker and simply laugh it off. You have been with a flat for so long (you may have bought the car with a flat tire and are still sitting at the dealership!) that you can't imagine driving. To take the analogy too far you are like those people who have an RV and go park it and put patio sets out, clotheslines, plant a garden, etc. so you can't even imagine the RV driving anywhere. You guys have found a way to survive on what you have now. My mind (or possibly something a little more sinister) is trying to convince me that my life is as good as it is going to get so just accept what I have and patiently wait for the bomb to drop again. Don't get too happy or comfortable because just when you do your whole life is going to fall apart.

String, I know you are a smarty pants. Since you are smart you know that your education never stops and you need to keep on learning and becoming more and more educated. God desires this for your marriage. He doesn't want you both to accept that you "have issues with sex" and thus just decide to do without instead- this is NOT healthy (or very fun :( ).

I still pray for you often and hope that one day I'll be able to give you a big- I TOLD YA SO!!!!

Thank you CJ..:hug: I like the flat tire analogy! Will contemplate that...