So what do you all think of faith and healing? I want lots of responses, people!!!!!!!

Erm... not real sure exactly what you mean. You talkin bout havin faith in healin? Er, jes faith er jes healin I'm not real sure but anyways.

If it's faith in healin then I believe in it for sure, I've expereinced it mysef. Member one time I was chasin a pig cross a pasture tryin to catch em agin an bein that I have had asthma I hit the ground jes bout dead an my mom wasn't far off an laid er hands on my chest an started prayin an instantly I could breath agin. There's been plenty of times when I was in trouble physically an had God heal me of sumthin er nother. I've seen God heal other folks to an there's a feller I know down near where I live that goes to some missions in mexico in the mountains an has come back wit stories of folks witout a leg er what have you an leavin walkin out of the buildin.

I've always been amzed at when Jesus said, if folks had faith the size of jes a mustard seed, you could tell a mountain to git up an throw its sef into the sea an it would do so. Mustard seeds are very small, an that says alot bout all of us in this world. We don't even have that much faith.

I meant faith in healing.

Yeah welp, I do believe witout faith you won't have healin also, regardless of what it is, a bug er a thin in your life etc. I really dislike folks that will take a gallon of oil into a hospital room an pray for someone an then walk right out the door an say sumthin like, " Well I donno...." They jes killed their faith an their prayers didn't make it past the roof.

Faith is a hard thin, jes cause we doubt everthin in life an it's hard to kill the fleash an allow the spirit to contorl everhtin. But when we let go an let God, an we believe He is goin to do what we have asked em to do then He will. God isn't moved by doubt but by faith in Him.

I believe all things are possible. Nothing's impossible for God.

BUT - you have to ask, is it in His will? In the grand scheme of the entire world, how will this healing affect everything? Yeah, one person's illness may seem like a drop in the bucket compared to the whole world, but there is an intricate woven pattern. We can't see the whole picture.

Here are my thoughts on the subject. Sometimes one has to suffer for a greater good. We don't like it, but facts are facts. My grandmother-in-law is in the final stages of Alzheimer's Disease. Diapers, can't feed herself, doesn't even know her own name. But her church reached out to help her during this time (after Kerense and I prodded them!), and my MIL has begun to attend church again - after a 20 year hiatus. Her return has prompted my BIL, who was once studying to become a preacher but became very disillusioned, to contemplate returning to the fold. With his return, his wife and daughter are both trying to find out what Christianity is all about.

If I had focused only on Grannie's illness, I would not have seen the impact on the rest of the world. Though Grannie (who, as far as I know, is among the faithful) is suffering, and will one day die from this disease, four people are in the process of being saved. God's not looking at simply our time here on Earth, He's also looking at our timeless eternity with Him. The more He can get, the better. After all, the angels throw a huge party every time one of us commits!

okay, the guy without a leg, how did he walk? did his leg grow back? was he fitted with a prosthetic? If he got a prosthetic, is that really healing or just equipping?


I'm not trying to be a smart aleck, jut want to clarify.

From the stories I've heard given by this feller, the man had no leg an the next thin he knew he had a leg, he never seen it grow, jes that it wasn't there an then it was. I've heard of tons of these stories over time that's jes one, but like I said in my own life I've expereinced mircalous if you will, healin. I've prayed for, been prayed for as far as asthma goes an I haven't been healed from it, but have been healed immediatly from attacks an what not, this goes somewhat in conjunction wit what Clay was sayin.

I agree to an extent, but the bible says it's not our place to be sick er infirmed etc but at times we are, an if it's for God's glory then brin it on. Personnaly, I've made over a 1000 bucks in asthma studies so I cain't complain to much hehe

I agree like I says, wit Clay in what he's sayin bout bein God's will, that's why I think it's important that we pray for an believe that God's will will be done. Yes I may want to be free from asthma, an if it's God's will to heal me from it then I'm all for it, but I have faith in the God of heaven an believe He is goin to do His will an not mine. (gotta go unload so cain't finsih the rest of the thought, be back after a bit)

My bipolar disorder - though not healed, has been relieved. I started medications for bipolar disorder in October 2000. Three years later, after intensive prayer and consultation with experts (most of whom were reluctant to say "do it!"), I stopped taking medications. My mood is dependent upon my prayer life. When I'm not walking with God, the rage and depression returns. After a rampage, I am able to return to God. I have learned to see it coming.

Take last night, for example. The kids were cranky and I was having trouble keeping them in line. I started yelling at them, even refused to say nightly prayers with them as is our custom. After all, if they don't want to listen to me when I talk to them, what makes me think they'll listen to me when I talk to God? (I know - twisted logic. But that's bipolar for ya!) Well, I didn't lose it. Kerense told me to take a break and go away for a while. Not 'cuz she's mad or afraid, but 'cuz she recognizes what's taking place. I went away, meditated and prayed for a while, then calmly spoke with her about what happened. Four years ago, that would've been a couch-throwing rampage. Last night, it was a calm discussion.

God didn't promise to heal me. He did promise to ease it when I stay in communion with Him.

A couple of months ago, we got an e-mail from Matt's cousin, suggesting that we have Phillip prayed over for healing. My first thought was that he's not sick. He was made with a part missing from his 15th chormosome and that's how he is supposed to be. Matt and I talked about it and we both felt the same way. There is a purpose for Phillip being born this way. We don't really like it and we want some answers but this is just how it is. Does this this mean we lack faith? I don't know. I want to believe that God really can move a mountain if I have enough faith, but I'm just not sure if I can. I have too many questions.
Anyway, we had Phillip annointed with oil and prayed over by our elders at church yesterday.

Hmmm tough boat Amy but what is God's will? You said ya'll talked an decided that's the way God made em an that's the way it is.... but have you checked wit God bout it? You really never know, this could jes be a way for God to brin the two of you into deeper relation wit Him. God's ways aren't always clear, we all know that. But if you believe in God healin your son then so be it. If you decide that this is the way God made em an left at that, it's your call. But I stress this, do not let other believers pray for him jes to have ya'll decide it's not goin to happen. That's not goin to help anyone really. I don't mean to sound mean er anythin I'm not tryin to. But jes IF you were wrong in thinkin that is the way it has to be an give up as it were an yet God is sayin hey, I'm waitin for you to do sumthin here. then you don't wanna be the road block.

You could very well be right, I don't exactly know the troubles involved wit havin this problem, an maybe God is goin to use that for sumthin later in life I don't know. But at the same time, if it's His will that your son should be whole then pray for that, but regardless of what you do pray for, pray that God will work in His way an not the way we want Him to. Believe that God has nuthin but the best in store for all of us an if He wants your son to be this way then fine, God will give you strength an the ability to handle everthin that arises, wether easy er not. That's why the bible says to seek His will. It's not an easy thin to do, I know from expereince that it's not.

I feel like I'm runnin round in a circle here so I'll go do sumthin else for I dig mysef to deep a hole.

Can God change that chromosome? I believe He can. After all, He created everything from nothing with only a word.

Will He? If it will bring glory to Him, He will. Think about the blind man in John 9. Why was he blind? Only that Jesus may heal him and prove who He was. How many countless others were not healed?

Perhaps, if Philip is healed, you can have a miraculous testimony to share with those around you. If he is not healed, you can have a ministry helping others in your position. There are many paths this can take, depending upon God's will.

My mother related a story to me about a friend-of-a-friend. The guy was in his 40s and had Parkinson's. He shook so much that he slowed his golf quartet a great deal. So, they dumped him. His friends stopped coming around and he got more and more depressed until he blew his brains out with a pistol. She said, "There's a good reason for euthanasia."

I replied, "Mom, what if people - especially people in the church - had reached out to him? Not only would he have a reason to live, but he would have had a marveous ministry opportunity. He could reach out to others in his position. His death served no purpose. His life could have, if only people would've given him a chance."

I pray for Philip's healing. We could be like the guy in the bible who said, "I believe! Help my unbelief!" Jesus may use a healing to show us exactly what He is capable of.

Oh - I almost forgot! Our worship minister's son, Ezekiel, is "developmentally impaired". What does that mean? Only the doctors know. I think it's their way of saying "We don't know why he's not growing up so fast." Well, you can read about Zeke here. Also, here is a GracEmail from Edward Fudge regarding his grandson:

I totally have faith in God's healing powers. I have personally witnessed it.....a good friend of the family was SO near death with cancer and infection in his bones, everyone was praying that he'd live long enough to see his grandchild be born, he went into remission & was able to see her and enjoy her for a very short while, then God took him home.

My grandmother was diagnosed with cancer, fluid around her heart, was given six months to live....that was nearly a year ago and on her last visit to the doctor they couldn't find any evidence of the cancer and the fluid was gone.

My mom had VERY bad sciatica (sp?) in her back & down her leg, so much so she nearly couldn't walk, had to use a cane. The doctor told her that the only way she could get better was through surgery, BUT he sent her to a physical therapist to see if that "might" help. Now she's pain-free without surgery.

Then all the "little" stuff....like when Andie had to have that root canal, when she split her forehead open, etc.

Yes, I totally believe in God's healing powers....and I also believe that His will being done. Meaning, I pray for healing of the people around me BUT I also pray that God will give me the wisdom & strength to accept whatever His answer might be.

I've heard of people walking into a prayer conference autistic then walk out "cured". Me, I have a hard time believing that. Yet I often wonder if it really is true. We've accepted Isaiah and his autism and the fact that he is simply unique because it's what God intended and well, we're learning to live with it. To be honest, if Isaiah were to be "cured" right now and we had to deal with a "normal" ten year old....we'd probably go through the roof! :D

Amy, didn't we talk about this a few months ago? This sounds familiar...

I believe God will heal what's meant to be healed. I believe we are fearfully and wonderfully made in His image. I believe that the god of this world (satan) creates illnesses and diseases to discourage and kill us. I believe that if we believe in faith, that God can and will use illness and disease to HIS glory. Now that may mean healing and that may mean something else all together...like maybe an outrageously joyful attitude in that illness.

I don't think it was discussed here before, at least, I know I wasn't a part of it.

I want to clarify some of my thoughts here a little. We know that God has a purpose in allowing Phillip to be born with this condition. We do not know what that purpose is. We are definitely open to the possibility that that purpose to to show His healing power :D , but mostly we want God's will to be done in Phillip's life. I believe God is going to do great things through Phillip and has already begun to do so.

By the way, Phillip polished off both of his bottles this morning. He's been making remarkable progress since Sunday.

Man - only 3 months old and polishing bottles already! See, he's got a future ahead of him! :)

That's good news, Amy. I know you're proud of him for that. Congrats!

After I wrote my initial response here, I left the house and went to my weekly bible study. We're studying "To Know Him" and while studying chapter four the subject of healing came up. It was interesting to me, since it had been on my mind from this thread.

So basically, my pastor's wife was saying that we are not healed because we don't accept God's healing and so we haven't received it. Which got me thinking. I said "so you're saying it's our own fault if we die of cancer." To which, in a round about way, she said "yes." The reason for this is that Jesus gave His all and died upon the cross for our sins. He bore our diseases, our sicknesses, our illnesses on his back. And by His stripes we WERE healed. Which means, we WERE healed more than 2,000 years ago, but we suffer because we haven't accepted this healing.

This really got me thinking. I can't get healing off my mind today. I've decided I need to study this more. I mean, to me, saying we're not healed because we haven't accepted it is like saying it's done by a work and not faith because it's something we have to DO...

Am I making sense? I think I'll go over to WOF forum on CF and see if I can get some of those folks to help provide some background on this for me. That ought to stir the pot.

Stir the pot, indeed! :o

ETA: While you're at it, ask them if they've ever know any one to be healed of Down Syndrome.

the reason you feel this way about this is because that is exactly what they are teaching--that you have the power to bring healing on yourself and not God. We are tiny little mortal people in the presence ofan all encompassing God. The WOF teaching that we tiny mortals have the power to control what God does-ie heals us or not--is totally incorrect, unscriptural, and blasphemous. The Word of Faith movement bases its theology not on scriptural revelaaiton, but the supposed "spiritual revelation" to its founders and leaders. I have an excellent book that discusses and brings to light the falsity of these teachings and ideas, but my mom has it right now. I will be going to her house this weekend and will get it.


As for healing from God--there is nothingwe as itty biutty mortal beings can do to put off or bring on the healing of God. Fi tit is in God'swill for us to be healed,then we will be, but ifit is not...we will not be healed of our afflictions. There is no promise of perfect health and healing in scripture. The world we livein isfilled with evil. At the fall, our paradise was altered. we letin death and sin. This has affected everythng on a cosmic level. Diseases, illnesses, hate, destruction....all of these things are a result of our own sinful behavior that began with Adam and Eve and these things will not be purged until Jesus returns to eradicate them. A mortal human being simply "believing" and having "faith"is not going to cause God to heal him. No matter how much faith we have, if it is not God's will then it won't happen. And remember that God promised us that this life will be full of trials and difficulties.

Children are bord with defects and diseases because of the twisted nature of our earth. It is not God's responsibility or duty to fix it all for His children.
Look at it this way--if you believe that your haivng faith is what it takes for God to heal you--then it becomes God's obligation to give you what you want because "you have faith that it will happen" . We can have faith and we can not have faith, but either way God is not obligated to fulfill our wishes based on our "faith that he will do it". We cannot control God. Claiming that things will happen becaue of "Faith" disteorts the realities fo what true faith is sets us many for a major disappointment.

Interesting fact: the majority of Christians that turned atheist come from Christian backgrounds that taught that it is our own faith and strenght of belief that causesthings such as healing to occur. The belief systems set it up to where it is your own fault for not having enough faith or believing that God will do what they want. They are taught that if it doesn't happen, they didn't truly believe. You can imagine how setting up such unrealistic expctations can cause some to fall hard and to turn away from God as a result of such an unsatisfactory experience.

What God chooses to do or not to do cannot be controlled by the levelsof "faith" we have.

No, Christ's death 2000 years ago did not heal us from diseases. It is not our own fault if we have a disease that has not been cured, that we have birth defects, cancers, deformities and have not been cured. No matter how much we would like to believe that thinking positively and believeing the impossible will happen willmake it happen, you have to remember that we ive in a mortal fallen world. It is a result of death in this world, and will not be overcome until Christ's return...God can heal us, but our faith or lack thereof has no bearing on His actions or power to do so.

Many people take a sliver of scripture out of context and try to misapply it. They make promises that God will not keep because they are not God's promises.

A sliver of scripture that came to mind reading Lynn's post is from James 4:2 "You do not have because you do not ask God." Read the next verse, though: "When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures."

Why does one want to be healed from cancer? Does God want to give someone rest in His eternal home? Do they want to stay here? Would their desire to remain on Earth be more important to them than God's desire? If so, they are asking with wrong motives.

In Amy's case, she has accepted that this may be God's will that Philip remain as he is. Should there be a miraculous healing, we will all rejoice with her. If there isn't, though, find God's plan in Philip. As Jesus prayed in the Garden, "Take this cup from me. But not my will, let yours be done" (Clay's paraphrase).

Yeah, we'd like to keep our loved ones with us for as long as we are alive. But there comes a time when they must rest. And we can rejoice when we see them on the other side.

Good point, Clay. When we depart this life, we are born into eternity. Many saints are commemorated on the day of their death, not because the Church has some morbid fascination with death, but because for us, who are in Christ, that is our final victory, wherein we overcome this world and death, to join God in heaven. Death is the greatest defense againt the heretical idea that it is always God's will to heal an individual. Everyone's body will fail at some point, uniting them to their eternal reward or eternal suffering. A very few exceptions, Elijah and Saint John, were taken into heaven without physical death, but that is not the case with us. If you take the faith teachings to their fullest conclusion, you must 1. blame the sick for their sickness, which is cruel, 2. believe that we could live forever if we had enough faith, which our experience shows is untrue. Even the greatest believers in our history have reposed eventually, with the couple exceptions I mentioned.

Years ago, when I first redirected my life toward Christ, I read quite a few Word of Faith writings and listened to Kenneth Hagin, Sr., on the radio. The belief that God has given all authority over to the believer is very seductive. They can rip some scriptures out of context and make a well-reasoned argument, based on these out of context verses, but we must look at the gospel as a whole, and also have enough wisdom to see that what they claim cannot be true. Their gospel is a gospel of men, based on faulty biblical interpretation and reasoning. God still heals, to be sure, and He can pity us and act based on our faith, but He is not bound to do so, as if some universal law of faith requires it.

Faith is not higher than God, as they teach. They say, God simply uses a principle of faith to speak things into existence and heal, and that if we tap into it we can do the same. This is a shameful teaching. It demotes God to some being who used power outside Himself to create the universe, and it falsely raises us to the same level as God, claiming we can do the exact same things, if only we use faith. This is a new age idea, shrouded in Christian terminology.

The Orthodox Church has twenty centuries recorded of signs and wonders, which have never ceased, so I certainly agree with that uninterupted witness that miracles and healings still occur. It's not bad to pray and ask for God's mercy to help break the suffering which is part of this life, but we should always pray that God's will be done, being ready to endure all things with gladness of heart, giving thanks for the good things we are blessed with, even though we deserve even less.

Basil

When my friend died of cancer, it was sad for us but exciting for her! She has complete healing now! Sure I'd like to have her back...but she's in a much better place. God healed her HIS way, not "our" way. :)